which jigsaw for hardwoods

[Not enough!!]

Good morning members, I'm after some advice please.

I need a really good jigsaw to cut curves and straights in hardwood (messmate, redgum, blackwood and she-oak) up to 125mm thick.

I found these 2, my budget is $300 + del.

Which would you rate as a better jiggy (not that sort of jiggy,jiggy :oo:) perhaps you could throw in another brand, but please remeber the budget.


Bosch 780W Electric Jigsaw With Dust Extraction #GST150CE | Just Tools Australia | Tool Specialist in Power & Cordless Tools, Hand & Air Tools (http://justtools.com.au/bosch-780w-electric-jigsaw-with-dust-extraction-gst150ce)


https://sydneytools.com.au/hitachi-cj160va-h1-800w-160mm-barrel-grip-jigsaw

Cheers
Stevo

ps

I emailed Bsoch Australia about the 160 CE availability in OZ the rotten so-so's didn't even bother replying, so that got my after sale service radar thinkg - why should they get my $$$

[elanjacobs]

There is no jigsaw that I know of that will do even a quarter-decent job in timber that thick, especially not in hardwood :no:

What you need is a bandsaw

[DaveTTC]

I generally would not cut thicker than about 50mm qith a jigsaw. Even at 50mm it is quite an art to keep your blade square as you cut a straight line let alone curves

Dave TTC
Turning Wood Into Art

[Not enough!!]

Thank you both for replying. Ok, l had my head up my bottom again/still,

I should have said how thick can these 2 cut in hardwood.

So back to the original question which of the 2 would you buy, or are they very similar, working on the theory of cutting <50mm.

I do have a bandsaw, but I like to take some timber onto the back lawn to cut up, bandsaw's too big for that!

[DaveTTC]

I have an AEG qhich is 20 yrs old now and stikk one of the best Ive used.

Withut looking at the specs my gut would say hitachi

Dave TTC
Turning Wood Into Art

[elanjacobs]

No idea about the quality as I haven't used either, but the power isn't the limiting factor when cutting thick timber, it's the fact that the blade is only held at one end with nothing to stop the bottom from going sideways. I'd call 50mm the practical limit for any jigsaw, regardless of price and power; you can get 100mm blades, but they're only useful for roughing, you have to get to your marked line by other means

[Chief Tiff]

I would say that the higher end saws like the two you've linked to will by and large all do the exact same job. Makita, Dewalt, Blue Bosch, Hitachi, Milwauki; personally I'd be looking at whichever one felt the best in my hand, had the easiest controls, came with the best accessories, comes in a box that doesn't require a PHD in Chinese puzzles to put it back into...

[Ratbag]

I've have had a few jigsaws over the years. Even got around to the odd review or two, so I won't repeat myself.

http://www.woodworkforums.com/f13/bosch-jigsaw-aussie-1590-evs-152469?highlight=mafell

What you're asking for isn't impossible to achieve. There is a saw (and ONLY one) that will perform the task required, but not at, or even near, your preferred price. Nothing new in that. Basic economics 101: scarcity vs. cost/benefits. More about that later.

Your suggested Bosch is basically placed at the "budget" end of their "pro" models range. It will be comprehensively outperformed by most of Bosch's high end range from the past 10-15 years: the 135, 140 and (naturally) 160. The model numbers, by virtue of some kind of unwritten German convention, usually refer to the tool's max. cutting capacity in softwood, and are common across much of the industry, apart perhaps by some manufacturers that maybe have something to hide.... Most makers' "pro" level saws (700w +) of the last 10 years or so will be better than the Bosch 150. So they should - they cost more too.

There's nothing wrong with the 150. Well... maybe the bodygrip format will take some getting used to if you're unfamiliar, and a bit too portly around the middle these days for a firm, safe grip. A bit like me in fact. I use both types, and can quite understand why bodygrips are the favourite of those that cut from underneath. No chipping of sensitive surfaces, and no dust on top. I can't undercut. It just doesn't feel right to me. When I cut melamine, veneer etc. I prefer to use a quality plungeing saw & rail, which are designed for straight cuts. For the rare occasions I need neat, tidy notches & curves I chose "upside down" or down cutting jigsaw blades and no pendulum.

The only jigsaw truly unworthy of the description these days seems to be Festo/ol. Woeful tools. I still break out mine occasionally just to remind myself how easy it is to waste $500 odd on a crap tool. Mine won't even cut vertically in 19mm ply! I had a 40 year old Elu (and a budget AEG) that does a neater & more accurate job! Apart from the other Bosch models, I also use & like Metabo's jigsaws too. Metabo's 140 has the slimmest motor diameter on the market (due I suppose to the company's technical expertise & market dominance in angle grinders), making it the (almost) wisest choice in bodygrips. The twin motion sensing LED headlights, switchable blower & automatic "soft start/accelerator" function also make it a fairly convincing alternative to top handled alternatives. It's (probably) my current favourite, and the most feature-rich (maybe gimmicky?) example currently available. I find it unsurpassed for having a clear, uninterrupted view of the cutline, too. I never use dust extraction on a jigsaw if it can be possibly avoided.

But for really heavy duty straight & curve cutting in hardwoods there's really only one choice: Mafell P1cc.

No stupid ceramic or carbide blade guides. No useful (gimmicky?) LEDs, no top handle alternative. Requires an accessory blade tilt soleplate just like the stupid Festo/ols do. Plus it's about 50% more expensive than the rest. But it has superior power (900w), capacity (which at a quoted 115mm seems underwhelming), and blade grip (wedged) & guidance. Plus there's also those hideously expensive, hand soldered and taper ground Cunex blades that offer unequalled precision & performance. But don't take my word for it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3U9iHDJbZo

Those Dutchies just love to show how overblown some manufacturer's claims are in the real world...

In summary then.... I think you could do better than the Bosch 150 for the money. A Second hand Bosch 135, 140 or 160 will be superior, as will a Metabo 135 or 140. Or an (English made) Makita like the Dutchies demo. As for the Festoes... I'm told they're pretty good at cutting sponge cakes. Note that I don't use the word Fess-tool much. That word is reserved for the idiots (like me) that buy them.

[BobL]

Just like the reciprocating saw thread, the limit for decent speed, depth and accuracy in cutting for jigsaws is the stroke length.

My Triton Corded Jigsaw (which I rate quite highly in terms of grunt an other features) has a stroke of 25mm (a fairly standard stroke for jigsaws) and a recommended max cutting depth of 85 mm but it struggles even at 50 mm in hard wood. The main thing I use it for is cutting holes in plastic and Al plate.

Like a lot of product specifications that can be interpreted I'd say the max cut for most jigsaws is probably about double the stroke length - after that he saw ends up mincing a lot of its own sawdust.

I'd be putting the $300 toward dust extraction and use the bandsaw inside the shed on the sorts of thicknesses you are referring to.

[Not enough!!]

The Mafell looks VG but out of my price league, so thanks for putting that up, maybe one day.

I will sush out all the brands mentioned for feel etc.

The dust collection idea is not so silly, l would have to build a outdoor soundproof enclosure for it, once my funds build up that is defiantly a goer.

So thanks everyone for the valuable inputs.

Regards
Stevo

[Canisbellum]

I have tried cutting 50mm hard wood with a jigsaw and it's an abysmal failure as the blade wanders off to the side no matter what and you end up with 45 degree cuts. A circular saw does a much better job than even a bandsaw for straight cuts. I wouldn't cut thicker than about 15mm with a jigsaw.

Sent from my SM-T810 using Tapatalk

[yowie]

If you are intent on a jigsaw, I have a high end Makita that I have hardly used I would be willing to sell at a good price? Let me know if you are interested at all and I'll get the details/ photos etc.

[Rod Gilbert]

To cut the sort of sizes you are talking any top end brand should be able to cope but the most important piece of any cutting tool is the blade that is probably where the most difference will be found. having said that I go back to what has been said before the flex in a jig saw blade in hard wood can be considerable. I have an old Metabo barrel type that can handle heavy work with the best of them.
Regards Rod.

[Not enough!!]

Hello Yowie, I've sent you a PM, Rod i guessed really good blades would make a big difference, so I must keep an eye out for those.

[PJM16]

Another option you have is to cut the design in 12mm ply or mdf and use it as a guide with a router and flush cutting bit. However you'd need a big router and good quality bit/s and go really slow.

[Ratbag]

Here's a "high end" Makita that should actually perform as required:

MAKITA STICHSÄGE 4351FCTJ 4351 FCTJ LED + MAKPAC + SÄGEBLÄTTER NACHF. FCTK | eBay (http://www.ebay.de/itm/MAKITA-STICHSAGE-4351FCTJ-4351-FCTJ-LED-MAKPAC-SAGEBLATTER-NACHF-FCTK-/351408713642?hash=item51d1976faa:g:JnwAAOSwBahVf~kd)

especially if teamed with premium blades like T344DP, T1044DP, T344D, T744D or T344DF. All of these are designed for cutting hardwoods <100, with one <135 & one <150mm.

Of course, none can be as accurate as a Cunex blade, which as previously mentioned is double edged, double shanked and radically taper ground; the only blade geometry ever created that will withstand the twisting torque of tight radius curvature in deep hardwood cuts <115mm (I'm told they work quite well in even thicker going too). This sort of punishment would destroy any lesser blade in mere seconds.

I think the secret of the P1's innate superiority isn't just in the blade wedge, but in the whole geometry of the front end. Rather than torturing the blade's edge & shank with forced pendular rotation from behind, which obviously will distort the blade (especially the bottom end) in heavy going by trying to push it's way through, the P1 does away with all forms of guidance, rollers, or ceramic pads to try to keep the blade running straight. Just having the extremely tight wedge alone do the work, and the elliptical mechanism geared within the upper handle rather than an eccentric lobe driving the roller makes for much smoother and markedly more accurate going.

It sounds counter-intuitive, but it just works, without all that useless, blade destroying extra guidance that Festo/ol and others think are required. Letting a superior, stiffer, well ground and carefully tapered free floating blade like the Cunex do the job allows the cutting edge to work WITH rather than against the stiffness & resilience of the shank and bayonet, even when side loaded such as cutting tight radii. That the whole setup also works just as well with the blade fitted backwards (for extra support in sensitive going) is additional testament Mafell's lateral thinking & engineering.

Here's how it goes in 100mm softwood using Bosch (nail biting progressor blades rated @ <65mm!) blades:

P1cc Perfection | Mafell Users Forum (http://mafell-users-forum.freeforums.net/thread/94/p1cc-perfection)

If you want accuracy, then as previously suggested, only a Mafell or a bandsaw will do what's required with any sort of precision. Be wary of other so -called "pro" level machines, that may end up being overpriced lemons. I'm talking now from my own personal experience.

[Not enough!!]

Hey RB, thanks for posting that, the Bosch "Progresser blades" aren't badly priced compared to the Cunex W1.

I will have to leave the jigsaw purchase for a little while, but thanks for everyone's help.

[Ratbag]

It sounds like you're def. on the right track anyway.

Cunex blades are expensive, yes, but given that they're pretty well hand made, their "unique" performance characteristics and ability to outlast the others also makes them arguably better "value" than they would otherwise seem. All blades fitted to a Mafell won't have any of that temper & blade killing metal to metal friction that destroys blades in any other type of saw. A Mafell's blade can be immediately removed & held in the fingers even after extended cutting: a finger-burning exercise in anybody elses'. I think that's why the Festo's blades don't last. It gets the blades so hot that it eats metal blades almost as fast as it eats wood! Plus there's the salient fact that Festo blades aren't a patch on their Bosch equivalents anyway.

2nd. hand is prob. the go ,too. You should be able to pick up a current model for a couple of hundred of so from the usual sources, or even a P1 (which admittedly don't appear very often as they tend to be valued more) for 3 odd.

I picked up my new Metabo for $180 incl. postage from the UK, which was pretty good even if it was just a bare tool without any extra guards, soleplates, or systainer. About half the new price for the "Plus" model in Oz, which is a fair price I thought: esp. considering neither Metabo Oz nor UK actually import the 140 "Plus" in bodygrip, just the bow handled variant. Actually the saw was only $120, and the remainder post. Mine was fitted with a Euro plug with a UK piggyback adapter.

I personally like the new Metabo because of its combination of ergonomic smarts and robustness, plus that "Kraut" feeling of quality that's becoming pretty rare these days. But as I've said before, all those "nice" extra features like motion sensitive headlights, auto accelerator etc. might be a bit gimmicky for some. I particularly like the lights & switchable blower, as my eyesight deteriorates with age.

Given that a 720w (135mm) Makita will cost about $350, an 800w (160mm) Hitachi about $300, and an 800w (160mm) Bosch about $500 odd new, I'd imagine about $150-200 would be a fair price point for a bare tool in good nick with a bit extra thrown in for blades, guards, systainers/L-Boxxes etc. + a wee bit for postage.

Take your time. It'll take a month or two for the right one to come up at the right price too I suspect.

[Lappa]

My 20 plus year old Ryobi jig saw died so I made the worst decision of my life and bought a cheap Makita 4327SP from Bunnies. Never been happy with it regarding cutting a straight line or cutting vertical. Yesterday I had to cut a rectangle out of a length of 45 X 90 pine. Fitted a new Makita wood blade, adjusted the roller and oiled it. Drilled holes in each corner then cut and wondered why the piece didn't drop out the bottom.

Here's the piece.

393017

It's going on Gumtree and I'll buy a decent unit following advice from this thread.

[Not enough!!]

I saw this a while back, yer I know its cordless but you get a rough idea.

Bosch Cordless Jigsaw Review – GST 18 V-LI S Professional Cordless Jigsaw | JordsWoodShop (http://jordswoodshop.net.au/bosch-cordless-jigsaw-review-gst-18-v-li-s-professional-cordless-jigsaw/)